[mythtv-users] Current wisdom on PVR-150/250/350/500

Brian Wood beww at beww.org
Sun Apr 16 02:47:30 UTC 2006


On Apr 15, 2006, at 8:05 PM, Sam Varshavchik wrote:

> Brian Wood writes:
>
>> RedHat certainly didn't help the situation by shipping a kernel  
>> that  would refuse to load the most widely-used driver module in  
>> the world,  and when they "fixed" that "mistake", they still have  
>> a system that
>
> It's wasn't their mistake.  This was something that went into  
> Linus's kernel.  Red Hat merely shipped what came down the pike.

It's a configuration option, and since they won't give out the config  
file they used to compile their kernel they made it harder than it  
needed to be to straighten out.
>
> And, once the issue was identified, there was not really any reason  
> to scramble and push the fix out right away, instead of waiting  
> until there were other reasons to push out a newer kernel that  
> backed out that change. It's not like this was breaking something  
> in Fedora.

It certainly seems that they should have tested their distribution  
with a config that at least 40% of their users would be using.

>
>> requires you to jump through hoops to get an nVidia driver  
>> installed.  THEY certainly won't tell you how to do it, and they  
>> have made sure  that the default paths are such that nVidia's  
>> installer will not  work, and that the required headers are not  
>> installed by default.
>> This is *not* the way to encourage people to use free software.
>
> nVidia is not free software.

Of course it isn't, if I implied that it was, it was unintentional.


>
> And, certainly, I do not see any reason why Red Hat would want to  
> encourage people to use Nvidia's warez.  In fact, their X.org  
> maintainer has stated that he was wasting a lot of time because of  
> people who run nvidia's installer, screw up x.org's default  
> configuration, and begin filing bugs against x.org without even  
> bothering to mention what they've done.

Well Gentoo has right in their docs exactly how to install the nvidia  
drivers *without* screwing everything up, and the drivers are  
supported by the portage system.

Keeping bogus "bugs" from being reported is reason enough to at least  
give tacit support to the binary drivers.

And I have *never* understood RedHat's not including the kernel  
source, and making it a real pain to get it. Even what they call the  
kernel "source" is not. I want something that I can go into and type  
"make", and get the very same thing that is running  my machine,  
configured the very same way it was when they made my kernel, is that  
so hard?

They claim the source is "too big", but they certainly include a lot  
of crap that is much larger and far less useful (gnome comes to  
mind). The very least they could do is to have one RPM that would  
install the real kernel source in one step, which they do not do,  
anymore (they used to).

They also used to have a "switch desktop" application built in to the  
default gnome menu, so you could switch to KDE with two clicks, but  
no longer. They are getting more and more like Redmond, which Is why  
I run Gentoo if given a choice.


>
>> Unfortunately we have the choice of FSF-unfriendly vendor A, or  
>> FSF- even-more-unfriendly vendor B, and they both know it.
>
> Correct.  And although our collective voices do not comprise any  
> noticable market share, continuing to use Nvidia's and ATI's non- 
> free software will do nothing to improve the state of things.   
> Neither Nvidia, nor ATI, have any reason to do anything about it as  
> long as most people are pacified by what they're doing now.  If  
> everyone stopped using Nvidia's and ATI's binary drivers today, I  
> don't know what difference it would make.  But I do know one thing:  
> continuing to use the binary drivers guarantees that nothing will  
> change.

OK, I agree with you, but if I want to run FC, and run Celestia (or  
any of a large number of programs), what would you suggest that I do?  
I don't know of any option other than somebody's binary drivers.

>
> So, those who use Nvidia's or ATI's binary drivers have absolutely  
> no standing to complain about it.

No, we would have to stop buying their cards to make any impression,  
and I'm not sure that would help anyway, as long as there is an  
adequate supply of 13-year-old gaming nuts out there.


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