[mythtv-users] Forced subtitles in mkv DVD rips.

[Alexander Fisher]

On 17 May 2012 15:57, Jason McLeod <jason at mcleods.me> wrote:
> On Wednesday, 16 May, 2012 at 4:04 PM, Alexander Fisher wrote:
>
> Hi
>
> I've just started ripping all my DVDs to mkv files for mythvideo, but
> I'm a bit confused as to how forced subtitles work/should work.
>
> My current process is
>
> 1. DVD -> ISO using 'DVD Decrypter' on Windows.
> 2. ISO -> MKV using Makemkv. At this point, I select just the main
> title and pick one main soundtrack (normally DTS if available
> otherwise 5.1 Dolby Digital). I also leave in all the 'English'
> subtitles.
> 3. Use mkvinfo to identify the subtitle track numbers, rip them with
> mkvextract and use vobsub2pgm so that I can look through the subtitles
> I left in in step 2.
> 4. Finally, use mkvmerge to remux the mkv removing all subtitle tracks
> (main English subtitle track, commentary subtitles etc.) leaving just
> any forced subtitle track (and setting the forced flag) I discovered
> in step 3.
>
> A bit long winded, but this should produce what I want and no more.
>
> According to the change log, new to myth 0.25 is support for
> automatically displaying the forced subtitles. This doesn't seem to
> be working for me.
> I only get the forced subtitles if I manually select the subtitle from
> the OSD. In the OSD forced subtitles are enabled, but don't display
> without manually selecting them.
>
> Is the issue due to me having removed the normal English subtitle track?
>
> Are there easy ways of identifying which subtitle track is the forced
> one? Makemkv doesn't seem to tell me. Ripping all of them and
> converting them to images before manually examining them is time
> consuming.
>
> Other than remuxing with mkvmerge, can anybody suggest an easier way
> of changing the 'forced' flag on a mkv subtitle stream?
>
> Many thanks for any help and suggestions.
>
> Kind Regards,
> Alex
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>
> My understanding of Forced subtitles, are that they are shown when story
> line is being progressed in another language.  Like the Russian parts in
> Hunt for Red October, before they zoom in and make everything English.

Yes.  This is what I understand by forced subtitles too.  Some films
are basically unwatchable without them.
Not being able to tell what the Na'vi are saying in Avatar, or missing
huge parts of Japanese dialogue in Kill Bill etc would ruin those
movies.
A significant minority of films have them even if they are just for
translating the odd line or foreign sign.

> When I use Handbrake, I typically choose your same settings, but I select
> the English subtitles and choose Forced Only as an option.  That way the
> subtitles only show up when they are supposed to.  And it works fine for me
> when playing back in the frontend.

I don't want to use handbrake as I'm only interested in preserving the
original dvd quality without any transcoding.  Extracting to mkv
allows me to save some space by dropping foreign soundtracks,
directors commentaries etc, as well as removing any bonus
features/interviews/FBI warnings etc I never want to watch.  My first
attempts at creating mkvs had me removing all subtitle tracks until I
realised I was throwing away the essential forced subtitle tracks too!
 Now I've discovered what these are, I really want myth to play them
without me having to remember to select them each time.

One thing I'm not 100% sure on is, are DVD forced subtitles always
completely separate subtitle tracks?  Or is it possible for just some
subtitles within part of a full subtitle track to be individually
flagged as forced?  If so, I might have to rethink my approach
completely.

Either way, I still haven't been able to get my rip of 'The Mummy' to
automatically display the forced subtitle track.  I've tried using
mkvpropedit to flag the relevant track as default as well as forced.
I've also tried including the main english subtitle track as well as
the forced track.  Nothing's worked.  Myth is definitely spotting the
fact that the track is marked as forced (in the OSD it displays
'forced' in brackets), but it still won't display it without me
manually enabling it.  *If* I was willing to transcode my dvds, I
believe software is available that will hard code subtitle tracks into
the video stream, but this isn't a quality sacrifice I'm willing to
make.

Kind Regards,
Alex