[mythtv-users] 0.25 Music

Thu Mar 8 18:17:27 UTC 2012

----- Original Message -----
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 6:44 PM, Nasa <nasa01 at comcast.net> wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> --- On Wed, 2/29/12, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > From: Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv at gmail.com>
> >> > one man's playlist is another man's queue. and vice-versa.
> >> I think the issue here isn't whether something is called a queue or
> >> a
> >> playlist, but rather: It seems mostly everyone here wants to be
> >> able
> >> to select a track and have it play, rather than have to go through
> >> the
> >> hassle of having to build a playlist then as a separate action, go
> >> play the playlist, even just for a single track. Thay also want to
> >> arrange and browse their music as files/folders already on the
> >> drive,
> >> not an artificial list order made by the player.
> >
> > Speak for yourself,
> 
> I rest my case... (friendly jab, I'll buy you a beer)
> 
> context for my thinking on how MythMusic should work as I sent
> previously: I've been thinking about the interface for MythMusic for
> about 4years, during which time I've lived with 9 different people (we
> have a 5 bedroom apt), and our friends, who have all used our apt-wide
> MythTV setup. during that time I've been able to follow the music
> listening habits of all these people, including what they are used to
> using on their laptops, and how they all interface with MythMusic, as
> well as how they have asked me to help organize their music on our
> fileserver for their use in MythMusic. My point is, I haven't read
> anything on this list as far as preferred use is concerned that I have
> not encountered from my sample group. There are a few distinct methods
> people have for how they listen and mentally organize their music.
> What I posted previously in this thread is what I've found to be the
> method that would cover the essential way people think in terms of
> music playback given a fixed database and screen. Granted, this method
> works best for those with an HDTV, and does require some "fancy" GUI
> effects, but it can be done, and I think would provide an excellent
> interface for music playback overall.
> 
> 
> > I never select a single track to play -- I have
> > no interest in selecting song after song after song. While I have
> > an extensive (over 150 Gigs) of music in a somewhat order folder
> > format
> > - I don't listen to my music that way. I tend to select a genre
> > (yes,
> > a total pain to organize) and listen to it. I may create unique
> > playlist
> > for future listening. I don't tend to listen to a full album and I
> > don't tend to listen to a single artist, only. You shouldn't assume
> > that the vocal members of the group represent the majority of the
> > group.
> 
> I'd be interested to know how you organize your music currently in
> MythMusic.

I don't actually organize my music using mythmusic... The only thing I 
do for customizing my listening options is to create "smart playlist".  
BTW: smart playlist don't have to be based on local media -- 
they just have to be access to the media (contrary to your suggestion
-- "Smart Playlists" - smart playlists(for only local media)).  In fact,
I don't even really doing that.  If I was programming it - which I'm not,
I don't want to do any organizing of my media on my TV/HDTV.  I wouldn't be
ripping media from that interface and I wouldn't be tagging my music from
that interface (with one exception -- ratings).  I expect to use my remote 
for all my interfacing when I am sitting vegging out on my 
couch.  But I do want options on how I play my music...  So, I would 
do all those types of things sitting at my desk via a website.  But 
that's just me.  Presently the web interface isn't up to that type of 
thing, so I do most of my managing of my media via MediaMonkey (yes,
I have to start a VM with WinXP so I can fix up my media). 

> 
> Did you read my post earlier in this thread as to my interface idea?
Sorry,

No I hadn't.  So I went back and took a look at what you suggested...
This screen

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_9ynZ1LviUi0/S1RV-OGG-MI/AAAAAAAAB5w/O9NGKiUW5ns/s1600/winamp+media+fixed.JPG

is (in my opinion) way, way too busy.  To get all that stuff on the screen - smaller fonts are going to be
needed, which means it's going to be hard to read and/or all the info I would be looking for will be cut off.
For example, the present themes (all that I have tried) cut off the total time for a song, specially recordings
that last over an hour.  

All the options you suggested are cool -- just not on a single screen.  A pop up menu with ability to select
which mode you want to find your music by is the way I would go (if I was coding it). 

> 
> 
> <snip>
> 
> >> As to the a) or b) scenario: Personally I'd feel that if you select
> >> an
> >> album (i.e. folder containing mp3s) you should get to hear all the
> >> tracks in it. If you select a single mp3 file then it should only
> >> play
> >> that one.
> 
> I agree with this, but I would also say that if I am viewing an album
> I may want to start half way through and play the rest.
> I think a better option would be a "single track" mode to playback.
> Right now there is a Repeat None/Repeat All mode, just add "Single
> Track" to this playback mode list.
> 
> 
> >> If you select an existing playlist file then you get to hear the
> >> playlist. Obviously this implies building a playlist should
> >> therefore
> >> save a file (ideally in a portable format like .m3u), so you can do
> >> it
> >> once and re-use the same playlist later, even if you make/use
> >> another
> >> playlist meantime.
> >
> > While I have long wanted a means to play .m3u files -- I am totally
> > down
> > with a means to import the playlist into the database and playing it
> > from there. While exporting a playlist maybe a nice feature, if the
> > developers
> > don't see fit to add that feature -- a table dump is pretty straight
> > forward.
> > You could probably do that today.
> 
> the problem I see with m3u files directly is that they would have to
> be created in such a fashion as to work with how the database finds
> the files. This would obviously then be best created through MythMusic
> or a compatible system for creating them (such as through MythWeb in
> some fashion).

Actually, creating a unique playlist (that would be difficult via a 
smart playlist) would simply be a list of songs.  Then mythmusic would 
search it's database for those songs and create a new playlist.  Options
for tweaking mismatches would be needed.  But it should be simple in 
concept.  The software is designed around the database -- and things
that take away from that focus should really be low on the priority 
totem pole.

> 
> I think the ability to export and import playlists in m3u format would
> be neat to have eventually but not essential. I would much prefer to
> see the general frame work for static playlists properly implemented
> initially though.
> 
> 
> >> Playing an album, track or playlist should always be as easy as a
> >> single action.
> >>
> >> The player should support a loop on/off toggle button. In loop
> >> mode,
> >> you would hear whatever you have selected re-played ad infinitum.
> >> Although I personally never use shuffle mode, I guess that would
> >> also
> >> be a nice option for others that do.
> 
> Shuffle and Play mode are separate concepts though, as they can be
> used in conjunction. So Shuffle should be its own mode along side
> playback (as mentioned above).
> 
> 
> >> Its not rocket science, but for some reason big companies like
> >> Microsoft and Apple have totally lost the plot. They have made
> >> their
> >> players so "user-friendly" it takes hours to learn and setup, the
> >> music library never ends up right, and it takes a million
> >> operations
> >> to find/play anything when it should be one click.
> 
> I disagree in some ways, at least in regards to iTunes, I have not
> used the latest Windows Media Player so I can't speak to that.
> I think the latest iTunes, and WinAmp as well since they both use
> essentially the same model (with iTunes being less powerful), it is
> very easy to do all the basic media playback the user could want. Yes,
> there exists the ability to more finely tune how you interface with
> the software, but I think of this as an advantage not a curse.
> As for the library and the requirement for "a million operations", I
> don't quite follow what you mean, I've never found this to be the
> case, if anything, depending on how I wish to play back my music it is
> either the same amount of work as going directly through my directory
> hierarchy, or easier for playback methods that do not fall in line
> with that hierarchy.
> Follow up, I don't see how you could ever have a one click system to
> find/play anything.
> Again, it could just be I don't follow what your thinking exactly in
> your brief writeup of your concerns.
> 
> 
> >> No-one wants a music player in mythtv like that, but from earlier
> >> posts it sounds like you're close to copying a lot of their ideas.
> 
> I've lost the context of this comment?
> 
> 
> >> Not that I think mythmusic will ever get this bad, but I especially
> >> detest media players that scan the drive for file types it
> >> recognises
> >> to build/store a "My Media" list. I also detest media players that
> >> have store frontends.
> 
> MythMusic is already this way, even if you have it display your music
> media in "directory" mode.
> 
> While I don't quite understand why you feel this way, I'm more than
> fine with your viewpoint on it, and why I feel regardless of what
> other sort methods are available, a "directory" mode should always be
> one of them, right now I use the directory mode in MythMusic, so at
> some level I do get it.
> That said, I would like to understand better why you feel this way,
> and what it is about the iTunes/WinAmp form of a media library that
> you detest?
> 
> --
> Steve
> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/User:Steveadeff
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