[mythtv-users] Our Only Option is Schedule Direct?

Michael T. Dean mtdean at thirdcontact.com
Wed Sep 19 01:34:29 UTC 2007

On 09/18/2007 08:53 PM, B Walker wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 20:07:13 -0400 "Michael T. Dean" wrote:
>> On 09/18/2007 08:25 AM, Braindead wrote:
>>> Personally I've found a find free source, simply pull the schedule
>>> from my wifes MCE box.  I see no problem with this as I've got an
>>> extra license for Vista premium that I'm not using anyway so I've
>>> paid for two computers to get listings.  
>> It's amazing how many free sources of listings information you can
>> find when you don't bother to read the license agreement/terms of
>> service.
>> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/mediacenter/evaluation/privacy/epg_tosV3.mspx
>> -----
>> The Microsoft software product identified above, which includes
>> computer software and may include associated media, printed
>> materials, "online" or electronic documentation, and Internet-based
>> services (the "Product") provides access to an electronic programming
>> guide service (the "EPG").
>> ...
>> Use of the Electronic Programming Guide Service. The EPG may only be
>> accessed with an authorized personal computer using the Product.
>> -----
>> Granted, that's from the Windows XP MCE EPG TOS, but I'm sure the
>> Vista MCE EPG TOS has similar "use with our product only"
>> restrictions.  If you know otherwise, please prove me wrong--I
>> couldn't find the actual TOS for the Vista MCE EPG, but would love a
>> link to it.
> The actual license for the EPG data is available on the MS website (don't have a link handy).  The EULA for Vista refrences it.

So are you saying that the link I provided above (
) is actually the link referenced by the Vista EULA?  If so, using the
data with anything other than MCE (or, in this case, the "MCE component"
of Vista) is forbidden.

>   It specifically states you may allow other members of your household to use the subscription.  It's of course surrounded by tons of other stuff that *could* be construed to limit that to just MCE computers.  As mentioned in other threads with various case citations, shrink-wrap/click-wrap licenses appear to be against the UCC according to several cases and have been held to be unenforcable.

I'd find the link to the actual TOS to be better proof than that...

Sharing the subscription with other members of the household has nothing
to do with sharing it with other /computers/ that are /not/ running MCE.

Whether a shrink-wrap licenses is binding or not has no influence on
whether MythTV/MythTV devs advocate breaking these licenses. 
Regardless, MythTV does not advocate doing breaking any licenses/TOS's.

>> "But I bought it..."  I know, I know.  You may have bought the
>> elevator, but...
>> So, rather than having paid for 2 computers to get listings, you've
>> paid for 2 Windows Vista MCE's to get listings.
> No, my Wife uses Windows MCE and Vista was purchased for me by a client (a client purchased Vista for me MS got the money just not from me, I figured I've got an extra license was more brief).  It took maybe 10 minutes to setup and I have scheduling information at no cost and no hassle and no need to have a Paypal account.  Sure, somebody (whoever provides EPG data for MCE) could try to sue me.  The chance of that is so small as to be negligible.  

But saying on /this/ list that using MCE data on MythTV is a legal free
source of listings may cause someone to decide that MythTV/MythTV devs
are supporting the use of MCE data for non-MCE uses.  If that's
disallowed by the TOS (whether the TOS is binding or not), the MythTV
devs can be forced

In truth, I couldn't care less what the likelihood of your being sued is
or even whether you get sued.  No offense, but it's your choices, so
/you/ should bear the consequences.

What I do care about is whether some outsider might think that MythTV
advocates stealing listings data because of something you or someone
else may say on the list.  If so, it's likely to cause some MythTV devs
to get sued, and I /do/ care whether the MythTV devs get sued.  (Where
"get sued" could more generally mean anything from receiving C&D letters
to having other legal issues to deal with.)


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