[mythtv-users] My schedule got deleted on upgrade!

Chuck Filson mythtv at goodeid.com
Sun Mar 25 19:10:40 UTC 2007

On Sunday 25 March 2007 02:09 pm, Michael T. Dean wrote:
> On 03/25/2007 11:45 AM, Rod Smith wrote:
> > On Saturday 24 March 2007 23:11, Michael T. Dean wrote:
> >> If your capture card/drivers change, you'll need to delete and re-add
> >> capture cards /and/ video sources.  You should also use the Delete All
> >> buttons to delete them; otherwise, you'll leave old data there that will
> >> likely cause problems.
> >
> > If by this you mean that you've got to assign video sources to input
> > connections using the Input Connections section of mythtv-setup, I agree.
> > If by this you mean you must delete and then re-create all your video
> > sources using the Video Sources section of mythtv-setup, then please
> > elaborate.
> Basically, if you need to change your video source, the best approach is
> to Delete All video sources and re-create video source, input
> connections, and channels.*  If you need to change your capture
> card/drivers, the best approach is to Delete All capture cards /and/
> Delete All video sources and re-create capture cards, video sources,
> input connections, and channels.**
> Why?  (a.k.a. "The Delete-All Manifesto")
> If someone sends me a MS Word document that I'm supposed to edit and/or
> format, the first thing I do is save it as plain text and then edit and
> properly format the unformatted version.  It's easier to ensure
> everything is done properly if you start from a clean state--rather than
> trying to undo what's wrong and do what's right.  (And, since MS Word >
> 2.0 has stopped trying to get people to properly format their documents
> and instead has changed "auto-whatever" to format docs the incorrect way
> most users did with MS Word 2.0 (i.e. Tab-Tab-Tab, Enter-Enter-Enter,
> everything default style, ...), you're almost guaranteed that any
> document you get is not clean to start with, but that's a whole
> different story.)
> Likewise, with Myth configuration--which, IMHO, is much more important
> than a cleanly-formatted Word document--the best way to ensure
> everything is cleanly-configured is to start from a clean state.  The
> more things change, the more likely starting from a clean configuration
> is /required/ (as opposed to just A Good Thing).***  When drivers
> change, you can take a chance that the old configuration might work, or
> just Delete All and reconfigure.  Even if most upgrades work without
> issue, once you start MythTV and find there are no available capture
> cards, the first thing you should do is Delete All.
> Also, recreating video sources, input connections, and channels all
> together ensures that the user verifies every aspect of the
> configuration.  Most questions users have when changes to these areas
> don't fix the problem are due to the fact that they missed some small
> value that also needed changing--perhaps in a section they thought would
> be unaffected.****
> Delete All also has the benefit of resetting capture card, video source,
> and channel ID's.  Therefore, when using Delete All, the OC crowd
> doesn't worry about, "I only have 2 cards, so why does the status page
> call them, 'encoder 1' and 'encoder 26'?"
> Also, using Delete All to reconfigure everything every once in a while
> ensures that you remember how to configure the system, so in the event
> of catastrophic failure, you're not starting from ground 0.  Instead you
> have some MythTV configuration knowledge in your toolbox.  If you
> configure your Myth box, run it for 4 years, lose a DB, and try to set
> up a new box, you're likely to spend a lot of time trying to remember
> how you had configured it last time.
> And, lastly, using Delete All and re-creating everything takes about 2
> minutes.  Changing miscellaneous values, testing, finding it doesn't
> work, changing more values, testing, checking the list archive,
> Googling, writing a message to send to the -users list, and waiting for
> some kind soul to spend >2 minutes to read your post and write a
> response (even if it's just the "Use Delete All to delete your video
> sources and then re-create video sources, input connections, and
> channels" post), takes a *bit* more than 2 minutes.
> I'd even venture to say that it's quite likely to take longer to dig
> through the setup screens to find the right value(s) to change while
> verifying the existing values than to simply Delete All and
> re-configure.  The /only/ way it could possibly be faster to change
> individual values is if you get /everything/ right the first time (and
> if you find things quickly).  In the end, though, you took a risk that
> saved you some amount of time less than 2 minutes.  Not, IMHO, a good
> cost-benefit ratio.
> If you completely understand all of the requirements of capture
> card/video source configuration (i.e. the rules in place in the code) as
> well as the linkage of the different pieces of data (both to other data
> and to the code), and the effects of changing each piece of data, feel
> free to change the occasional value.  But, if after I suggest Delete
> All, someone tries a different approach "because the 2-minutes to
> re-create everything is too tiresome," he/she shouldn't be surprised
> when I fail to reply again if there are still issues.  ;)  I've been in
> the MythTV code--through many sections that describe the rules for this
> data--and I have a pretty good understanding of the data, but I /still/
> use Delete All.
> (Well, you /asked/ me to elaborate...)
> Mike
> * "mythfilldatabase won't add channel X to my video source."
>   "I deleted a channel, but it keeps coming back."
>   "I added a channel, I can see it in LiveTV, but when I try to schedule
> a recording from that channel, it doesn't record anything."
>   "My cable company re-numbered all my channels, so I changed them in
> the DB/mythtv-setup/MythWeb and now my scheduled recordings don't work."
> ** Television/Tuner 0
> *** Sometimes changes require data modifications that cannot be made
> through the mythtv-setup UI.  Changing values directly in the database
> is always the wrong solution (
> http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/255378#255378 ), so the
> only supported approach is using Delete All and re-configuring from
> scratch.  (Why not make all values editable directly in MythTV?  Hmmm.
> Good point.  Perhaps MythTV configuration isn't complex enough... ;)
> **** "It didn't work the first time, but when I used "Delete
> All"/dropped the database and re-did it, it worked!"  (Since Myth isn't
> changing when someone drops the database, do you want to guess what does
> change?)

	This is starting to sound a lot like another operating system.

	"You must reboot for changes to take affect."


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